Well... not like these lame Roman Gods. Cooler ones with arrows and thunderbolts and big fists and stuff.
I’m thirty-six and I never learned how to date.
Back in high school when first dates were innocent and slow I assumed I was too ugly to attract a woman. (insert reader sob here. Wait… Did you actually sob? If not, go back and re-read. I want sobbing, dammit!) I did go on one date, but that was it. Other than a random kissing session, that was all I had.
Most of college went the same way until I went out with my first real girlfriend, Lisa. She and I clicked right away and started a relationship. It ended when I graduated a few months later. Then I was in St. Louis for a year not doing much of anything. I simply didn’t know anyone. After that I went to work for the beer company and traveled 100% for two years. The longest relationship I had was a week in Buffalo. That’s it.
Then I got off the road and went nuts for a few years in my twenties. I met a ballerina later on and dated her for several years. But she lived in a different state, so I never saw her. After that I basically met my wife and got married a few years later. After the divorce I dated a reader of the blog, interestingly enough, but that just ended a few months back. More or less, that’s my dating history.
Now that I’m single again I’m actually going to be dating for real for the first time in my life.
Here’s an important distinction I just learned – you shouldn’t always go for the heavy makeout on the first date.
I had no idea that wasn’t appropriate. I don’t think I’ve ever had a first date where that didn’t happen. I just assumed that was how you determined if the date was going well. If you got the makeout it means she likes you. This is the level of my dating maturity. So, I’ve always gone for the makeout. And, I’ll tell you, it can make someone really uncomfortable. Ha. I swear on the Bible I just assumed every date should end with a heavy kissing session.
By the way, can we bring back the phrase “necking”? I’m not 100% sure what it means, but is sure sounds awesome.
Well, just recently I ruined an opportunity for a second date for this very reason.
I went in for the kiss. I went in hard. She initially pulled away (I was very persistant). Eventually she relented and kissed back. We did a standard five-minute makeout. I thought the rest of the date went great. The next day she IMd me and said that while she had a fun time she now only wants to pursue a friendship as she was uncomfortable with how forward the first date became. She was right to think this. She didn’t really want to kiss me. I took this initially as rejection. Actually, it wasn’t. She has continued to build a relationship with me and I believe she’ll be a good friend.
When I met with my therapist this week I knew it was time to sort out my need to get quick physical approval from a woman. The reality is I just didn’t have any experience otherwise. She reminded me that seduction is to build naturally and can’t be forced. It’s also not the acid test to determine is the date is going well. Lastly, just because I’m horny doesn’t mean I need to act on it. When I started to mention that I felt the urge to kiss women on dates, she held her hand up to stop me and just said, “Resist.”
I need to remember that dating is an interview. You’re both learning about each other and determining if the position fits.
Get it?! Ugh – that was terrible.
While a first date could lead to everything including sex or nothing physical the most important piece is that you spend time trying to connect.
Now that I’m removed the sexual side of a first date the pressure is way off. I don’t have to worry about when to make a move. I don’t have to serve pie for dessert and then right before she takes the first bite, just as the fork is going up to her lips, I grab the utensil gently and remove it from her hands. I place it back on the saucer, move the pie to the coffee table and set it down. Then I attack her mouth with the fury of a thousand Roman Gods.
I’m obviously kidding, as I’ve never successfully pulled off that move. It would go down in the books at the greatest first date kiss of all time.
Well… not like these lame Roman Gods. Cooler ones with arrows and thunderbolts and big fists and stuff.
28 thoughts on “I’ve Always Gone For the Makeout – A Confession”
Brendasays:
Well you like people to leave comments after they’ve read your blog. So here I am. Unfortunatly I don’t have anything to say. I don’t know how to respond to this one, and usually I have something to say about everything. sorry.
Not sure if this is diving into feminine “slutty mcslutslut” territory… but as a woman I kinda had the same philosophy as you… unless I was not interested in the guy. Most of my first dates that lead to second dates or relationships ended in a lengthy goodnight kiss. I don’t really have a problem with that. But, I haven’t been single for 6 years, so not sure how I would feel if I had to start over today.
Not sure if I’m alone in my thought process–but if the first date was spend with good conversation and connection, I like passion at the end. Good luck in your single adventures!
I think the problem is that too much passion sends a mixed message. The truth is you don’t know the person well enough to try to get all their clothes off, yet. And women tend not to want to continue seeing that guy. Just my experience.
I think the problem is that too much passion sends a mixed message. The truth is you don’t know the person well enough to try to get all their clothes off, yet. And women tend not to want to continue seeing that guy. Just my experience.
Kristinasays:
I haven’t ever dated. At all. In high school and college I just wound up in long-term relationships. And since then I haven’t gone on a single date. I think one of the reasons I don’t, now, is that I don’t know how. It seems like so much work, and I don’t really feel lonely, so I don’t try. I may regret that later. Maybe I’ll start setting up practice dates, with people I don’t really like, just to attempt it!
I love the fact that you have been such a loyal reader over the past year. You rock, madame. Oh, and start dating, for chrissakes!
Katjanewaysays:
I’m considered a nervous nellie. You so would have chased me away 😛 But then again, I’m so insecure of myself I may have given you another chance. I forgive rather easily.
Chasing Amy? Get it? That was dumb. Sorry. (your name is Amy, fyi)
Susansays:
I’m so happy to read this. Like Jean, I think a date (even a first date) typically ends in a little “necking” if you feel so inclined. The problem is when one feels there’s a connection, and the other doesn’t. So the safe thing is to avoid it, I suppose. Give it some time. It is kind of gross to kiss someone you don’t have a pretty strong connection with, so unless you know for sure, a peck on the cheek is probably safe.
I’m single, too, so I really love hearing things like this from guys. Thanks!
Kimsays:
Thanks for this! I don’t feel so alone now! I tended to end up in relationships and never really dated. Went on my first date in 13 years just last Friday and he totally went for the hot make out! I didn’t resist but I didn’t expect it either – but in my case it was a pleasant surprise. I think your therapist has a point but I am not sure you should always resist, you just shouldn’t always expect that it is appropriate. If you go into a date not expecting to make out or more….then if it does happen it’s a bonus! But what the hell do I know I haven’t dated in 13 ye —er 3 days! 😉
Dating sucks. I sucked at the few I went on – awkward, what are they expecting/feeling, does it match what I’m expecting/feeling? Gag. Most of my relationships came out of being friends first; all of those I knew from school or work or through a friend.
Jennsays:
Is it possible she’d reconsider and give you another chance after she reads this? Maybe if she understands why you did what you did (and really, how often do women have the opportunity to know why a man does what be does?), she might have a change of heart?
Jennsays:
Is it possible she’d give you second chance? Maybe if she understands why you did what you did (and really, how often do women have the opportunity to know why a man does what be does?), she might have a change of heart?
Carl ToersBijnssays:
Surely you don’t expect me to believe you now do you? 30 something and not know how to date? It should naturally lol
I can see why this is going to be one of your most read posts, DJ. You are, hands down, the MOST insanely honest person, and also the most in-touch person, I’ve run across in many a moon. I’m a survivor of so many disastrous relationships, it’s not funny. Well, actually, it is damned funny. I like what you said about the passion part, though and I think both you and your therapist are right. But, in reading the comments, I guess it boils down to this, and it’s probably a holdover from the 60s, when I was coming up (yeah, I’m one of your “silverbacks” a more hilarious description for geezeress I have yet to run across) “DO WHAT FEELS GOOD.” How is that for stunning wisdom of the ages? I’m like eleventy-billion years old, so I don’t give a shit anyway. No. I’m 57 and am just glad I don’t have to fret over this. I still get idiots trying to pick me up in the grocery store, WTF? I spaz and run. But, this ain’t about me. I look forward to more of your shenanigans and escapades.
heidisays:
Don’t beat yourself up too much. I think first dates are a lot harder on men than women. Men have to pick the restaurant: meat eater or Vegan. The movie: Action-too violent, Drama-too boring, chick-flick-trying to hard. Afterwards-Drinks or Coffee. Even if you ask us our opinion, we will go with our standard. “Whatever you think.” (Actually, you should enjoy this part because it’s the only time you truly get to decide.) Then if everything else goes well, is she going to be more offended if you try to kiss her or if you don’t. Tongue or no tongue, and the whole time we are just wondering if we wore the right shoes. Hang in there 🙂
Jennifersays:
I also didn’t start “dating” until after my divorce….and it was no easier at 32 than it was at 16. I now consider myself an expert….I have had lots of first dates and could probably write a book (or at least a blog!) about it. My advice—-no we don’t need to make out, but definitely kiss me, and put a little effort into it. I need some sparks. If there’s no sparks, there’s no date #2 for you. But if you’re all over me and making out like a repressed teenager at a Princess Leia convention, there’s no date #2 either. Welcome to “My Mouth is a Fine Line….Good Luck Walking It”
Erinsays:
I’ll admit it… I laughed when you said to sob. And then laughed more as I kept reading. Mainly since I completely related. I’m married but dated badly until I met my hubs. And well, long story short, due to injury, we barely even make out now! Feel free to laugh ( ahem, sob). So I always feel like I’m on a first date now and am totally looking for a make out when I shouldn’t be. Mother f’er. I shall follow you to see if you get better. I look forward to unintentional comedy.
Confession: I like the first date make-out too…but I get that it’s a short cut through some important preliminaries… I got a first date hug recently (big bear hug), and I liked that quite a bit too.
I’m going to experiment with holding back a little, and report back to you 🙂
Danasays:
So I am exactly like you, I have no idea how to date. I always assumed making out and/ or sex is how a date should end. Lucky for me the one first date I go on that ends will just a hug and peck is the one that will end with me getting married in March. My point being that the way I was worked for me at the time but when I met the right guy it was so different that I knew it right off the bat. Good luck dating. It sucks.
So I’m going to go ahead and agree with you here. I too recently divorced and trying out this dating thing…SO MANY RULES. (WTF!?!) When I was in college dating usually started with some embarrassing moment in a frat house. At 36…not so cute. So here is my problem. I’m not sure I want to get married again, so my trouble is this, most men my age have either never been married or are like me recently unmarried. When you happen upon a dude, worthy of a date, one of two things happen. 1. He sizes me up for a wedding dress before the entree arrives. (no thank you.) 2. He goes in for the make-out too soon, making me think he just wants to do me. (flattering but no…or strong maybe anyway)
So the question for you becomes, how do you avoid being sized up as a groom? You must be in the same situation as me. I would love to meet and hang out with someone awesome. Live in my house be all independent and junk but have someone who likes to be awesome with me. Eliminating all the shit I hated about being married and keeping all the shit I liked about being married. Curious.
I think that this is a totally subjective situation, but it’s subjective based on things you don’t yet know. For example, I love physical affection, but not from people I either don’t know well or have just met. I’m one of those people who cringes when touched too much in a crowd, and after several hours on a first date, I am basically on people overload. But, that’s not something you really talk about on a first date, so it’s not really something you’d know at the end of said date. So in my case, on a first date where I presumably just met that guy, I would be totally weirded out if he actually made out with me…a little kiss is fine, but a full on make out would have me running for the hills!
That being said, I’m just one woman, not all of them. We’re all different. But, I think your therapist is probably right…when in doubt, just resist.
Petsays:
I laughed reading this because my idea is and continues to be a good date ends with a kiss. Ok, maybe not a full on make out session, but if I am interested and wish to see someone again, I let them know a kiss is required. The reason: I can’t and refuse to date a bad kisser. So, if we clicked and things go well, there is only one more thing I need to know before agreeing to seeing a guy again: is he a good kisser?
Judging by how you hit it off, I think you should go on a date with Brenda. I would pay to watch that. I’d even bring my own popcorn.
Wendysays:
Being a new dater (is that a word??) myself this both frightened and amused me…. I laughed so hard that the women went along with the 5 min make out (without saying back off jack) only to say she wasn’t comfortable?.. Really. Then your therapist raises her hand and says “resist” ? Personally I would have started giggling in the therapy session. 🙂
Maureensays:
I was very fortunate to meet the love of my life at 20. He was 32. He was the funniest person, had cool job coaching basketball and was my best friend. He made it clear marriage was not for him.
I didn’t want to get married until after I created my successful career.
I was shocked when he asked me to marry him 5 years later. He asked 2 more times but I was so young when I got into the best relationship ever – bur marriage?
I waited too long so at 32 I was not as I thought – going to see the world – well yes I did lots of that but my belief that I would probably have some dates but relationships would just happen.
I hate dating. I have had 2 boyfriends since Steve and they both had one or more girlfriends.
My fragile heart and me know he’s out there but I enjoyed my non dating years – one after each betrayal.
On passionate kissing? Never pass if the spark is there and it’s usually evident midway through dinner or a few hours. Just stop at the kissing and anticipate slowly all the rest.
Just my experience.
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Brenda says:
Well you like people to leave comments after they’ve read your blog. So here I am. Unfortunatly I don’t have anything to say. I don’t know how to respond to this one, and usually I have something to say about everything. sorry.
D.J. Paris says:
I left you speechless? I didn’t think that was possible!!! Thanks for being such a great reader!
Brenda says:
You’re welcome, but I don’t want to be just a great reader.
Jean says:
Not sure if this is diving into feminine “slutty mcslutslut” territory… but as a woman I kinda had the same philosophy as you… unless I was not interested in the guy. Most of my first dates that lead to second dates or relationships ended in a lengthy goodnight kiss. I don’t really have a problem with that. But, I haven’t been single for 6 years, so not sure how I would feel if I had to start over today.
Not sure if I’m alone in my thought process–but if the first date was spend with good conversation and connection, I like passion at the end. Good luck in your single adventures!
D.J. Paris says:
I think the problem is that too much passion sends a mixed message. The truth is you don’t know the person well enough to try to get all their clothes off, yet. And women tend not to want to continue seeing that guy. Just my experience.
D.J. Paris says:
I think the problem is that too much passion sends a mixed message. The truth is you don’t know the person well enough to try to get all their clothes off, yet. And women tend not to want to continue seeing that guy. Just my experience.
Kristina says:
I haven’t ever dated. At all. In high school and college I just wound up in long-term relationships. And since then I haven’t gone on a single date. I think one of the reasons I don’t, now, is that I don’t know how. It seems like so much work, and I don’t really feel lonely, so I don’t try. I may regret that later. Maybe I’ll start setting up practice dates, with people I don’t really like, just to attempt it!
D.J. Paris says:
Hi Kristiners!
I love the fact that you have been such a loyal reader over the past year. You rock, madame. Oh, and start dating, for chrissakes!
Katjaneway says:
I’m considered a nervous nellie. You so would have chased me away 😛 But then again, I’m so insecure of myself I may have given you another chance. I forgive rather easily.
D.J. Paris says:
Chasing Amy? Get it? That was dumb. Sorry. (your name is Amy, fyi)
Susan says:
I’m so happy to read this. Like Jean, I think a date (even a first date) typically ends in a little “necking” if you feel so inclined. The problem is when one feels there’s a connection, and the other doesn’t. So the safe thing is to avoid it, I suppose. Give it some time. It is kind of gross to kiss someone you don’t have a pretty strong connection with, so unless you know for sure, a peck on the cheek is probably safe.
I’m single, too, so I really love hearing things like this from guys. Thanks!
Kim says:
Thanks for this! I don’t feel so alone now! I tended to end up in relationships and never really dated. Went on my first date in 13 years just last Friday and he totally went for the hot make out! I didn’t resist but I didn’t expect it either – but in my case it was a pleasant surprise. I think your therapist has a point but I am not sure you should always resist, you just shouldn’t always expect that it is appropriate. If you go into a date not expecting to make out or more….then if it does happen it’s a bonus! But what the hell do I know I haven’t dated in 13 ye —er 3 days! 😉
Kate Hall says:
Dating sucks. I sucked at the few I went on – awkward, what are they expecting/feeling, does it match what I’m expecting/feeling? Gag. Most of my relationships came out of being friends first; all of those I knew from school or work or through a friend.
Jenn says:
Is it possible she’d reconsider and give you another chance after she reads this? Maybe if she understands why you did what you did (and really, how often do women have the opportunity to know why a man does what be does?), she might have a change of heart?
Jenn says:
Is it possible she’d give you second chance? Maybe if she understands why you did what you did (and really, how often do women have the opportunity to know why a man does what be does?), she might have a change of heart?
Carl ToersBijns says:
Surely you don’t expect me to believe you now do you? 30 something and not know how to date? It should naturally lol
Mary Wallace (@ViolaFury) says:
I can see why this is going to be one of your most read posts, DJ. You are, hands down, the MOST insanely honest person, and also the most in-touch person, I’ve run across in many a moon. I’m a survivor of so many disastrous relationships, it’s not funny. Well, actually, it is damned funny. I like what you said about the passion part, though and I think both you and your therapist are right. But, in reading the comments, I guess it boils down to this, and it’s probably a holdover from the 60s, when I was coming up (yeah, I’m one of your “silverbacks” a more hilarious description for geezeress I have yet to run across) “DO WHAT FEELS GOOD.” How is that for stunning wisdom of the ages? I’m like eleventy-billion years old, so I don’t give a shit anyway. No. I’m 57 and am just glad I don’t have to fret over this. I still get idiots trying to pick me up in the grocery store, WTF? I spaz and run. But, this ain’t about me. I look forward to more of your shenanigans and escapades.
heidi says:
Don’t beat yourself up too much. I think first dates are a lot harder on men than women. Men have to pick the restaurant: meat eater or Vegan. The movie: Action-too violent, Drama-too boring, chick-flick-trying to hard. Afterwards-Drinks or Coffee. Even if you ask us our opinion, we will go with our standard. “Whatever you think.” (Actually, you should enjoy this part because it’s the only time you truly get to decide.) Then if everything else goes well, is she going to be more offended if you try to kiss her or if you don’t. Tongue or no tongue, and the whole time we are just wondering if we wore the right shoes. Hang in there 🙂
Jennifer says:
I also didn’t start “dating” until after my divorce….and it was no easier at 32 than it was at 16. I now consider myself an expert….I have had lots of first dates and could probably write a book (or at least a blog!) about it.
My advice—-no we don’t need to make out, but definitely kiss me, and put a little effort into it. I need some sparks. If there’s no sparks, there’s no date #2 for you. But if you’re all over me and making out like a repressed teenager at a Princess Leia convention, there’s no date #2 either. Welcome to “My Mouth is a Fine Line….Good Luck Walking It”
Erin says:
I’ll admit it… I laughed when you said to sob. And then laughed more as I kept reading. Mainly since I completely related. I’m married but dated badly until I met my hubs. And well, long story short, due to injury, we barely even make out now! Feel free to laugh ( ahem, sob). So I always feel like I’m on a first date now and am totally looking for a make out when I shouldn’t be. Mother f’er. I shall follow you to see if you get better. I look forward to unintentional comedy.
Sharona Zee says:
Confession: I like the first date make-out too…but I get that it’s a short cut through some important preliminaries…
I got a first date hug recently (big bear hug), and I liked that quite a bit too.
I’m going to experiment with holding back a little, and report back to you 🙂
Dana says:
So I am exactly like you, I have no idea how to date. I always assumed making out and/ or sex is how a date should end. Lucky for me the one first date I go on that ends will just a hug and peck is the one that will end with me getting married in March. My point being that the way I was worked for me at the time but when I met the right guy it was so different that I knew it right off the bat. Good luck dating. It sucks.
Thelma says:
So I’m going to go ahead and agree with you here. I too recently divorced and trying out this dating thing…SO MANY RULES. (WTF!?!) When I was in college dating usually started with some embarrassing moment in a frat house. At 36…not so cute. So here is my problem. I’m not sure I want to get married again, so my trouble is this, most men my age have either never been married or are like me recently unmarried. When you happen upon a dude, worthy of a date, one of two things happen.
1. He sizes me up for a wedding dress before the entree arrives. (no thank you.)
2. He goes in for the make-out too soon, making me think he just wants to do me. (flattering but no…or strong maybe anyway)
So the question for you becomes, how do you avoid being sized up as a groom? You must be in the same situation as me. I would love to meet and hang out with someone awesome. Live in my house be all independent and junk but have someone who likes to be awesome with me. Eliminating all the shit I hated about being married and keeping all the shit I liked about being married. Curious.
Crystal @ I Totally Paused says:
I think that this is a totally subjective situation, but it’s subjective based on things you don’t yet know. For example, I love physical affection, but not from people I either don’t know well or have just met. I’m one of those people who cringes when touched too much in a crowd, and after several hours on a first date, I am basically on people overload. But, that’s not something you really talk about on a first date, so it’s not really something you’d know at the end of said date. So in my case, on a first date where I presumably just met that guy, I would be totally weirded out if he actually made out with me…a little kiss is fine, but a full on make out would have me running for the hills!
That being said, I’m just one woman, not all of them. We’re all different. But, I think your therapist is probably right…when in doubt, just resist.
Pet says:
I laughed reading this because my idea is and continues to be a good date ends with a kiss. Ok, maybe not a full on make out session, but if I am interested and wish to see someone again, I let them know a kiss is required. The reason: I can’t and refuse to date a bad kisser. So, if we clicked and things go well, there is only one more thing I need to know before agreeing to seeing a guy again: is he a good kisser?
Tongue Sandwich says:
Judging by how you hit it off, I think you should go on a date with Brenda. I would pay to watch that. I’d even bring my own popcorn.
Wendy says:
Being a new dater (is that a word??) myself this both frightened and amused me…. I laughed so hard that the women went along with the 5 min make out (without saying back off jack) only to say she wasn’t comfortable?.. Really. Then your therapist raises her hand and says “resist” ? Personally I would have started giggling in the therapy session. 🙂
Maureen says:
I was very fortunate to meet the love of my life at 20. He was 32. He was the funniest person, had cool job coaching basketball and was my best friend. He made it clear marriage was not for him.
I didn’t want to get married until after I created my successful career.
I was shocked when he asked me to marry him 5 years later. He asked 2 more times but I was so young when I got into the best relationship ever – bur marriage?
I waited too long so at 32 I was not as I thought – going to see the world – well yes I did lots of that but my belief that I would probably have some dates but relationships would just happen.
I hate dating. I have had 2 boyfriends since Steve and they both had one or more girlfriends.
My fragile heart and me know he’s out there but I enjoyed my non dating years – one after each betrayal.
On passionate kissing? Never pass if the spark is there and it’s usually evident midway through dinner or a few hours. Just stop at the kissing and anticipate slowly all the rest.
Just my experience.